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The Secret Board -> 3 Million dead...and counting.
 
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  ZORRO
 
November 28, 2003 10:23:45 am
 
  2nd Line Scorer

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3 Million dead...and counting.
While the media spends 24/7 on Michael Jackson and Scott Peterson three million people have died so far this year from AIDS.
As many as 46 million people world wide are living with the virus.
This according to a new UN report released this past week.

5 Million new cases this past year alone.
The epidemic is rampant in sub-Saharan Africa. More recent epidemics in China, Indonesia, Papua New Guinea, Vietnam, and several Central Asian republics are growing.

It is quite clear that our current global efforts remain entirely inadequate for an epidemic that is continuing to spiral out of control.
Africa alone has 29 million infected people.

While we pay attention to Mike and Scott......this virus may kill us all.

The medical profession has stated that this virus started with white middle-class gay men, but today, if you use a sterotype, the face of AIDS is a young women from Africa.

 
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  aquaman
 
November 28, 2003 10:56:11 am
 
  annoying, but not truly contentious

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The situation actually appears pretty hopeless. The sub-saharan countries do not want "western" help with anything and the help that is provided in the form of medicine and food is taken to enrich the corrupt leadership.

Perfect example (and there are many) is Mugabe in Zimbabwe. He came into power to rid Rhodesia of white rule (which would have been fine if he really had the interest of the country in mind). He then proceeded to destroy the country.

What is the world supposed to do with this? I sure don't know.

 
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  Rasp
 
November 28, 2003 11:06:16 am
 
  Floppy

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KMFDM
 
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"Staple guns: Because duct tape can't make that 'kaCHUNK' noise." -xkcd
 
 
   
  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 11:46:46 am
 
  Nutsack

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quote:
aquaman said...
What is the world supposed to do with this?



Strangle them with the condoms they won't accept or use.


 
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Ladies and gentlemen and JG if you'll look off the cabin to your left, you'll see a fat lady falling in a hole.
 
 
   
  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 11:50:30 am
 
  Nutsack

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quote:
ZORRO said...
While we pay attention to Mike and Scott......this virus may kill us all.



No offense, but it's not my fault, and it is not my problem. The U.N. and various world health organizations have made condoms, education, etc. available to people around the world, and they refuse to make use of what is provided for them.

At some point, you have to throw up your hands in frustration, and let them kill themselves. For chrissake, what else do you want the rest of the world to do? Education hasn't worked, fere condoms haven't worked. What would you propose?

Why not spend the money on research for a CURE or at the very least, an immunization, rather than insisting on burning up money trying to get people to make the right choice, when they clearly have no intent to do so.

 
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  olmsted
 
November 28, 2003 11:54:14 am
 
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I don't know Poster, we could keep trying.
 
  [ PM olmsted ]   Edited by olmstead November 28, 2003 1:04:26 pm.
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"Any knowledge man acquires is acquired by his own will and effort, and that is his distinction in the universe, that is his nature, his morality, his glory.ö
 
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  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 12:04:50 pm
 
  Nutsack

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quote:
olmstead said...
I don't know Poster, we could keep trying.



I've had very bad luck with that approach.

Edit: Your post and your signature line represent a bifurcation that makes my head spin.

 
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Ladies and gentlemen and JG if you'll look off the cabin to your left, you'll see a fat lady falling in a hole.
 
 
   
  aquaman
 
November 28, 2003 12:32:56 pm
 
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quote:
olmstead said...
I don't know Poster, we could keep trying.



There is NO use in trying as long as the leadership in those countries doesn't step up to the plate and quits "raping and pillaging" their own people.

Many sub-saharan African nations represent the ultimate welfare state. The leadership stays in power and pads their own lifestyles by keeping the people impoverished and dependent.

Example is again, Zimbawe. Mugabe has implemented a "program" of taking all privately owned land owned by whites. He does it simply by sending in thugs. Here is the bad part. Does he distribute it to the people for their good? No, it goes to "friends" who are as incompetent at farming as he is at leading a country. Before long, the money crops are no longer there and the country spirals downward.

The UN and World Health Org are some of the biggest money wasters the world has ever known. They have no solutions and the ol' keep trying is hollow.

 
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  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 1:05:13 pm
 
  Nutsack

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The leadership in those countries isn't going to stop raping and pillaging their own people. Leaders like that have shown time and time again that they have no interest in being benevolent or kind. The only way to get people of that nature to stop the atrocities against their own people is to drop bombs on their heads. Which opens up a whole new can of worms, and since they're not white folks, you won't see it happen anyway.

I was shocked that we sent troops to Liberia. Pleasantly shocked, but shocked nonetheless.

 
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Ladies and gentlemen and JG if you'll look off the cabin to your left, you'll see a fat lady falling in a hole.
 
 
   
  aquaman
 
November 28, 2003 1:26:45 pm
 
  annoying, but not truly contentious

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quote:
Poster said...
The leadership in those countries isn't going to stop raping and pillaging their own people. Leaders like that have shown time and time again that they have no interest in being benevolent or kind.



Exactly

 
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  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 1:42:59 pm
 
  Nutsack

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quote:
aquaman said...
Exactly



The problem is that when you start dropping bombs on these assholes, weak-hearted liberals like MiLM start crying and whining about this and that. However, as strange as it may be for these same people who are all about preaching equality between races, I GUARANTEE you that they would be 100% behind the same military action, were we defending Bonn from the Chinese.

I fully endorse, and wholeheartedly support the decision to send troops to Liberia, for what it's worth. I am only disappointed that we didn't send a larger show of force.

I'm sure Bush and his advisors are anxiously reading this board awaiting my opinion.


 
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Ladies and gentlemen and JG if you'll look off the cabin to your left, you'll see a fat lady falling in a hole.
 
 
   
  aquaman
 
November 28, 2003 1:54:57 pm
 
  annoying, but not truly contentious

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quote:
Poster said...
The problem is that when you start dropping bombs on these assholes, weak-hearted liberals like MiLM start crying and whining about this and that.



Other problems:
1.World perception which is important like it or not. If you go into a desperate place, even with good motives, the same bleeding liberals say it is the bad ol white man imposing his will.

2. Who do you put into power? New boss, same as the old boss? 200,000 whites and 4 million blacks. Makes sense for African rule, but when incompetent power hungry replaces racist but competent, it is a no win.

3. Which goes back to problem #1 again.

 
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  Michael in Lost Mt.
 
November 28, 2003 1:56:02 pm
 
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quote:
Poster said...
The leadership in those countries isn't going to stop raping and pillaging their own people. Leaders like that have shown time and time again that they have no interest in being benevolent or kind. The only way to get people of that nature to stop the atrocities against their own people is to drop bombs on their heads. Which opens up a whole new can of worms, and since they're not white folks, you won't see it happen anyway.

I was shocked that we sent troops to Liberia. Pleasantly shocked, but shocked nonetheless.



Poster-The only reason we sent any troops at all to Liberia, as a symbolic gesture, is to preserve the American myth of the U.S's founding of that sorry-ass excuse for a nation & to preserve the notion that America "honors it's comittments, blah, blah."

Of course, part of the problem with African politics is that political opinion & political partys largely fall along ancient tribal lines, so that politics just becomes an extension of tribal warfare.

It's sometimes difficult to believe our human race ever rose from that murderous slime of Africa.

Thank God some of them got out of there to become the fathers of the rest of us.

I saw a recent documentary on AIDS which said that Africans & many Asians don't have as much genetic resistence to AIDS as Europeans, who incidentally/accidentally got some "genetic immunity" to AIDS as a result of the Black Plague, & that those Europeans who had the genetic resistence to the Plague also have more resistence to AIDS, but that Africans, etc are genetic "sitting ducks" to be killed from AIDS, just as American Indians died by the endless thousands from measles, smallpox & other diseases introduced by Europeans.

MILM


 
  [ PM Michael in Lost Mt. ]   Edited by Michael in Lost Mt. November 28, 2003 3:29:29 pm.

 
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  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 1:57:31 pm
 
  Nutsack

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quote:
Michael in Lost Mt. said...
Poster-The only reason we sent any troops at all to Liberia, as a symbolic gesture, is to preserve the American myth of the U.S's founding of that sorry-ass excuse for a nation & to preserve the notion that America "honors it's comittments, blah, blah."

MILM





Yes, I know that, and that's the part that disappoints me. We really do need to do something about Liberia. I am glad we at least gave a half-hearted effort, but I wish that we had given a better effort.

 
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Ladies and gentlemen and JG if you'll look off the cabin to your left, you'll see a fat lady falling in a hole.
 
 
   
  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 1:59:43 pm
 
  Nutsack

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quote:
aquaman said...
Other problems:
1.World perception which is important like it or not. If you go into a desperate place, even with good motives, the same bleeding liberals say it is the bad ol white man imposing his will.



Fuck world perception. If we're supposed to be the "protectors of democracy" then we need to do so, not***** foot around with what Helmut Kohl thinks. If he bitches too much, promise Berlin to Moscow.

quote:
aquaman said...2. Who do you put into power? New boss, same as the old boss? 200,000 whites and 4 million blacks. Makes sense for African rule, but when incompetent power hungry replaces racist but competent, it is a no win.


Yes, that is a conundrum. However, you cannot tell me that there is not a single qualified individual on the whole African continent to run a country. The idealistic answer is to let the people of the nation choose their own leader. Unfortunately, the problem in that solution is that the people in most sub-saharan African continents are generally so horribly uneducated that they couldn't begin to make the right decision.

 
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Ladies and gentlemen and JG if you'll look off the cabin to your left, you'll see a fat lady falling in a hole.
 
 
   
  aquaman
 
November 28, 2003 2:03:09 pm
 
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quote:
Poster said...

Yes, that is a conundrum. However, you cannot tell me that there is not a single qualified individual on the whole African continent to run a country.




This is the part that puzzles me as well. You'd think that at least one guy would rise up with the true best interests of his people at heart and then implement programs to elevate the country and not just the elite.

 
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  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 2:06:06 pm
 
  Nutsack

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By the way, "world perception" was not against us when thousands of U.S. soldiers were mowed down at Normandy.

World perception wasn't against us when the U.S.S. Iowa pulled into port with tanks.

World perception wasn't against us when we sent thousands of U.S. citizens to die in a war on a continent a thousand miles away.

You're welcome, France.

 
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Ladies and gentlemen and JG if you'll look off the cabin to your left, you'll see a fat lady falling in a hole.
 
 
   
  Michael in Lost Mt.
 
November 28, 2003 2:10:47 pm
 
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quote:
Poster said...
quote:
Michael in Lost Mt. said...
Poster-The only reason we sent any troops at all to Liberia, as a symbolic gesture, is to preserve the American myth of the U.S's founding of that sorry-ass excuse for a nation & to preserve the notion that America "honors it's comittments, blah, blah."

MILM





Yes, I know that, and that's the part that disappoints me. We really do need to do something about Liberia. I am glad we at least gave a half-hearted effort, but I wish that we had given a better effort.



Poster-I could draw parallels between Liberia & our involvement in Iraq, but not now.

But in Liberia, I don't completely blame the U.S. for the sorry state of the Land, but they are branded, like cattle from our past enslavement of them.

Trying to return those slaves may have been a noble idea or just a wish to rid our hands & souls from the blood & sin of slavery, but it's as difficult as trying to returned domesticated wild animals to the jungle, which it largely resembles.

MILM


 
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  aquaman
 
November 28, 2003 2:19:42 pm
 
  annoying, but not truly contentious

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quote:
Michael in Lost Mt. said...
But in Liberia, I don't completely blame the U.S. for the sorry state of the Land, but they are branded, like cattle from our past enslavement of them.




Since you brought it up. What do you do about the "supply side" of the slave trade. Given that the western white man created the "demand side" of the equation (which is a simplistic way of looking at it in the first place), why do we not demand accountability from the Africans that supplied other Africans?

 
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  Poster
 
November 28, 2003 2:21:32 pm
 
  Nutsack

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quote:
aquaman said...
Since you brought it up. What do you do about the "supply side" of the slave trade. Given that the western white man created the "demand side" of the equation (which is a simplistic way of looking at it in the first place), why do we not demand accountability from the Africans that supplied other Africans?



That's a politically incorrect, yet very valid question.


 
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